Citation: Goddess Mode. "Chaos Magic Playground: An Experience with 4-HO-DET & LSD (exp104771)". Erowid.org. Oct 15, 2016. erowid.org/exp/104771
This is a trip report that I've been meaning to officially upload, one that I wrote a little over a couple of months ago. I didn't write down the times of dosing at the time so I can't give solid numbers on when each dose was taken.
Soon my schedule isn't going to allow me to trip very frequently and when I do it probably won't be in as perfect of circumstances as I can have now, so I've been wanting to make the most of the time that I do have left. For this evening, I decided to take about or a little over 25 mg of 4-HO-DET. I wanted the beginning of this trip to be everything already prepared and easy for me, so the first thing that I did is fill up two balloons of nitrous oxide until they were full and clipped them so that they wouldn't shrink. Then I ate the powder whole and washed it down with some water and pretzels, and finally I loaded myself a bowl of cannabis and hopped in the shower.
In the past I've found 4-HO-DET to be one of the most intriguing psychedelics that I've tried. When I was growing up, I was always interested in learning how to modify the reality that I was faced with.... I started with learning about computers so that I could mess with the video games I was playing. In middle school I actually met this kid just a bit older than me who I thought was clearly some kind of genius; he could do things with this one online game that we were playing that I had never even dreamed of being possible through hacking, and he and I actually became good friends and he taught me and introduced to others who also taught me many things about programming and reverse engineering. After that I took a 3D modeling course during the summer and then started actually trying to write my own programs in high school, including taking computer science classes. I found the idea of having my own domain where anything was possible to be exhilarating. During this time I also had my first lucid dream completely by chance, and some friends and I even had our own private server for an online game for a while in which we just went completely crazy and flew all over the maps and summoned huge monsters to cause chaotic destruction and just had all kinds of fun constantly bending the physics of the game. At the same time as all of this too, I was just constantly researching the mind and human and animal psychology.... I had been doing that in my free time since at least middle school.
I think all of these things that I've mentioned were key to leading me to be so excited about hallucinogenic drugs. I was already incredible pumped about lucid dreaming once I realized that you could live out any of your wildest fantasies in that way, but I truly found psychedelics to be even more interesting.... I felt like psychedelics just put the processing power of your mind even higher than dreams, and plus they allowed you to modify your perception of reality in realtime while awake, which to me always feel more meaningful than experiencing something in a dream. Nonetheless, I also got myself into an on-and-off habit of lucid dreaming that sort of ran its own unique time course but was still parallel to my use of psychedelics and other hallucinogens, and I credit this at the reason that I was able to dive so deep into and gain so much control over both of them. Expanding my awareness of my mind and how my hallucinations work helps both of these states equally of course. I should say too that I've always had sort of a set idea of how to work my control.... Another thing that I was really into while growing up was just getting lost in all sorts of abstract fantasies, and there were some consistent themes throughout these. One was that they often followed dark magical themes involving things like demons, insanity, and witches, and the presentation of different magic forces in my imagination being invoked was typically just intense and over the top. I liked just throwing things around in my imagination and causing huge explosions and complex magical patterns filled with abstract hieroglyphics and such because I felt like it was training both my control of my imagination and my visualization capabilities.
With that in mind, one of my longest lucid dream goals has actually been to get to myself to a point where my dream body just kind of by default materializes in the witch form. Whenever I use powers too, I tend to cast them like magic and focus on things like flying, elemental control, and summoning. It's all just in good fun, but I think that having such a set idea of what I want has really helped move me to the point of having as much control as I do now.... So, generally when I take any psychedelic, as long as it's a decent enough dose, I see some hallucinations of humans in at least some way. I feel like each individual psychedelic sort of has its own personality, and that vibe meshes with my own personality to effect the kind of mindset I have during the trip, which alters the kinds of hallucinations that I get a bit from my normal imagination. As I've mentioned before, my visuals consist almost solely of female entities in erotic outfits, but they can still change considerably in style from one trip to the next. Most psychedelics cause this powerful euphoric delirium in me which tends to make the imagery all very cosmic and divine, and also very romantic or sensual in theme. LSD has always been a noticeable exception to this for me, as even though it is incredibly euphoric, the trip always felt like it had this dark and down to earth edge to it. And I don't mean dark in a bad way either, because as I said I had those kinds of interests while growing up and still do.... There's an aspect to this dark part of the trip as well which feels like causes this sort of delirium which, much more so than the mental effects I get from most psychedelics, feels like it's based more so on my regular thought process, and it causes it to start replacing my external reality. It actually starts to feel like my visual field completely breaks apart into entities' arms reaching out at me, and the more overwhelming it becomes, the more I get pushed into a realm where literally anything becomes possible.
On LSD, this intensification of the normal cognitive realm has a very curious effect.... I feel like one of the things that makes LSD unique is the fact that while it does strongly inhibit ego functioning, at the same time it's also incredibly rewarding, which allows that primal part of you that does remain to become enhanced and confident and in control. I feel that it's because it puts so much focus on that reinforcement that, for me anyway, the trip actually becomes pretty heavily focused on my perception of myself, which can change considerably during the trip. When the feeling of pure ecstasy is given into, I tend to even feel that there is no difference between my body and subconscious's conditioned idea of peak physical beauty.... This is something that actually helped me to get over a lot of issues that I used to have when I started tripping. Because my own self image is part of the hallucinogenic experience as well, the abstract erotic outfits that I normally see on other entities are also perceived as being on myself; however, this has always been conceptual rather than physical even if I was hallucinating it quite vividly over my normal body. LSD is also very human.... While the concepts do get quite bizarre, they never make me feel like anything more than just a very confident person.
So, there is a reason that I'm covering all of this, I swear.... On 4-HO-DET I get much of the same grounded feeling, but even more so than LSD, but without the reinforcing feeling. In fact, it may be the least reinforcing psychedelic I've ever used. I actually describe it as tripping while sober... but somehow, still tripping hard. Though it lacks the focus on my self image that LSD has, it makes up for it being a far more powerful hallucinogen, and still quite delirious, even causing my perception of reality to become overwhelmed visually in much the same way. Also, even though 4-HO-DET feels even darker to me than LSD, it still retains many fantasy elements that LSD does not for me, and the feminine imagery I see tends to have a strong feeling of that dark magic, witches and sorceresses and the like, all very seductive and lustful.... This is what has placed at pretty far at the top of the list of my favorite psychedelics, along with LSD.
So, in the shower I could feel the 4-HO-DET kicking in, but it wasn't feeling overly strong. This was my first time taking it with some recent tolerance from tripping the previous week, so I had been a bit worried that it might not be up to what I was hoping for. When I turned off the water and dried myself off, I smoked some of the cannabis that I had prepared in the hopes of bringing it out a bit, which helped slightly. Afterwards I decided to go use the nitrous oxide that I had prepared to see if that would help really kick off the trip. It did make me feel very relaxed and a bit trippier for a bit, but it seemed like this experience was going to have some trouble launching.... It occurred to me that this was also my first time taking 4-HO-DET after being awake all day, and I was starting to wonder if the fact that it's so strongly based on my normal thought process rather than speeding it up and altering it might backfire on me when I'm tired enough that I don't really have much of a normal thought process. I was getting visual hallucinations similar to what I'm used to from it too, but they were weaker and more transparent in style, and they didn't seem to be stable enough to build up to anything. I could tell that there was genuinely something there though, and I really didn't want that dose to go to waste....
A thought entered my mind, that I could take another psychedelic on top of this that I know would work as long as I did it quick enough before too much tolerance set in, and then it would just be like tripping on that but with borrowed elements of this experience. The only one I have that I really felt comfortable with though is LSD. I was having a little bit of physical tension going on and I was afraid from reading around that 4-HO-DET might raise blood pressure, so I was a little hesitant too because I wasn't sure what mixing a high dose of LSD with that might do because I've honestly never heard of anyone using this combination before and I already haven't been feeling at my healthiest lately, but around two hours after my original dose I figured that I didn't have much time to wait anymore and I had pharmaceuticals that could help with any dangerous symptoms if they occurred, so I decided to take what probably amounted to two or three hits of LSD. An hour after that I could tell that it was taking effect, but I was worried that it wasn't going to reach a high enough intensity to make something of the lingering 4-HO-DET trip.... Not wanting even more of my supply to go to waste, I took a strip of LSD worth at least another few hits.
During this time I had still been smoking more cannabis, and did a couple small balloons of nitrous oxide while taking this LSD to help bring things out some more. It wasn't until about half an hour after my last dose that I started to get some pretty heavy time dilation though, and it was at that point that I knew that I had finally succeeded in turning this into a more worthwhile experience. Just before this I had also taken a small dose of benzodiazepines just to add an extra safety net for the physiological effects, and it was seeming to successfully reduce any considerable body load and relax me into the trip even more easily without detracting from the experience at all, which was great. I decided to load another full balloon of nitrous oxide, and was ready to dive into it at just under an hour since that last strip. What followed was one of the most intense things I have ever experienced in my life.... Normally, when I trip there is this sense or urgency or needing to 'take things all the way', like my whole trip is a build up to that point and then finally things become incredible.... Almost without fail, a full balloon of nitrous oxide can take me to that point, and I know exactly what it happens because up until then I will feel like it's hard for me to vocalize as much, but as soon as I hit that point I burst into completely unrestricted laughter, and from that moment on the trip is nothing but euphoria. That happened from this particular balloon which was like the true start to the experience, but it went so much deeper even than that....
Whenever I've been using nitrous oxide on psychedelics, there's been a specific kind of trip that I get from the combination which seems to pick up exactly where it left off after each time. It will be like suddenly my mind will be sent into chaos and I will experience an extremely vast amount of thoughts, feelings, emotions, and behaviors, all at once. In fact, I'm starting to feel like each time this happens it takes me to a point where it feels like no time has passed since the last time I was in that place, which along with the increased amount of information to take in gives it an extremely believable feeling of having the trip last longer and longer with each time, even though I'm only dissociated for the same span of time with each one. It truly feels as though I am stretching further and further into eternity. So, these concepts which nitrous oxide allows my brain to cycle through rapidly become more and more complex, and because of the hallucinogenic potential of the psychedelics I'm on, they become represented vividly in all of my senses as well, no matter how completely insane or illogical they might be, or how realistic.
Somewhere in that eternity I experienced the similarity dualities of heaven and hell that I've seen on nitrous oxide and LSD before, but this was even more real. I was completely unthreatened by the hell, but the heaven I allowed to wash over me, and I felt as though I was isolated in a cosmic cocoon in which every aspect of my perception was just completely perfect, completely satisfied, no worries or care or needs or anything, just complete bliss.... Further down in this infinity though was what really blew my mind.... All psychedelics tend to have some basic color schemes for me, having full spectrum visions but always having a few dominant colors stand out.... LSD has very dark neon colors closer to the blue end of the spectrum, while 4-HO-DET has vibrant thick colors closer to the red end for me. However, the way that this nitrous oxide experience ended was that suddenly I saw every color of the rainbow in complete vividness, all cycling through each other around a point one at a time, until they hit black and white which paradoxically existed simultaneously, and suddenly my reality snapped and I felt as though I was perceiving colors that don't even exist. One I only vaguely recall which might not be exactly right was one which I think was like a white, a green, and a red all at the same time, and there were two others I distinctly recall describing as a reddish cyan and a blueish magenta.... I should note that neither of these colors seemed close to purple in any way.
So as I said, I came out of that with a burst of euphoric laughter. The transition into ego loss always feels quite orgasmic for me, especially on nitrous oxide.... I was left in this just completely satisfied and immobilized state for a few moments while I regained my breath, and in that time the real trip had started to make itself apparent. I have experienced this with psychedelic combinations before in the past.... When I'm still in the come up or not quite tripping hard on enough on more than one psychedelic at the same time, it can really feel like the experiences are fighting each other or just not really working out that well at all. However, once that feeling of full peace is finally reached by whatever means, things tend to have a way of just working themselves out.... The mind becomes a canvas and the multiple sets of visuals start to work together in the most artistically beautiful ways that one psychedelic alone often just can't compare to.... The ways that they effect my mind begin to intermingle quite abstractly as well, putting me in a downright bizarro world. These are the things that I was starting to experience from the 4-HO-DET and LSD after this balloon.
My perception had become filled with a large and highly complex visual that appeared to be like viewing the center tip of an information spire on some kind of of massive technological geometric structure. I feel like the center of this and three arms branching out in equal distances from each other were mostly black, but also every color of the rainbow at once and also those same colors I saw from before that don't even exist. The three areas in between the arms started out in a basic red, green, blue pattern, but then started becoming filled with vivid and fast-moving scenes such as reviews of the history of humankind. The longer that I watched this, the more it felt like I was sinking into a tunnel focused around one point in my perception, which would zoom further and further into the foundation of reality until the hallucinations turned significantly three-dimensional, then four-dimensional, and then just completely shattered reality in ways that I can't even begin to describe.
I got up and walked around the house a bit to see more of what the trip had become. I was actually getting an interesting type of kaleidoscopic pattern that had elements of delirium in it including things like insects in it which I have gotten from LSD alone before, but the geometric style through which it was portrayed here is one that I have only gotten once previously, also on a combination, but a phenethylamine and tryptamine one that involved neither of these substances. There was something very interesting going on with the visuals in general.... I actually felt like I had opened myself up to some kind of dark magic domain. I was getting what I'm used to with 4-HO-DET in relation to the dark themes like witches and sorceress, but while that like other tryptamines tends to feel very realistic or dream-like in its presentation, that concept was now synergizing amazingly with the demented, cartoony aspect of LSD, along with its energetic and lustful edge. I felt as though I actually had the same control of my visuals that I did on my previous LSD trip and they were even similar in containing hieroglyphics, but this time they were more like power runes streaming in mathematical trajectories all around me, and with my will I could direct and throw them any way I wanted to, causing all sorts of intense geometric shockwaves to explode into existence around me.
This whole time, I also had the LSD effect of feeling like my self-image is intensified and feels completely perfect, but in addition to that I now perceived myself to in fact be more witch-like. I constantly felt as though my hair and clothes or bed sheets were flowing around me and with every action I did just because of how much energy I was giving off. My imagination had also taken on a highly vivid, large, and defined spherical structure. There were both dots and lines which each covered the circumference of the sphere around the center but at different angles to each other that were constantly traveling around the edge of the sphere, and again using my will I could speed this process up and cause all of these dots and lines to crash into each other furiously and create both intense visual distortions around me and cycle through many different thoughts, emotions, and feelings that I'm capable of experiencing.
At some point (during the rest of this experience time was heavily dilated for me and I kept no record of what happened when) after just enjoying the energy and dancing around and training my imagination like usual but with the added visual show, I decided to do another large balloon of nitrous oxide. What I can mainly say about it is that I've noticed that this spherical imagination thing happens a lot on nitrous oxide for me, but I think it's a part of my normal perception honestly.... But when I do it, it basically causes the same process that happens when I speed it up myself, but even more so. This balloon caused it to push even further that the previous time, again adding the feeling of extended time dilation, and my mind was pushed into areas of perception which attempted to conceptualize feelings of infinity. I honestly cannot describe it in any way other than to say that I indeed felt myself to be infinity... just everything at once. I came out of it feeling even more out of it than the previous time, and I ended up just getting up to play with my perception again.... This trip felt like it lasted so long to me, almost more than any other trip I've ever had, and there were so many intense and wonderful things that happened in, but unfortunately most of them are just things that I can't convey in a meaningful way through words, or at least were just so intricately complex that it's impossible for me to remember all the little details about every single one aside from just knowing that it was some of the most amazing experiences of my life.... However, there is one thing that I definitely do want to share.
There was one point during the night while the LSD was still peaking and the 4-HO-DET was still going pretty strongly, and I decided to smoke some cannabis and then just lie in bed in the dark and meditate. Almost immediately after getting myself into a completely and utterly relaxed position, I slipped effortlessly into an out-of-body experience. It was of a kind I've experienced before a few times where I feel as though I'm experiencing it both from a first-person perspective and from a third-person perspective which is pointed directly at my body, and I perceive a spherical space with my body at the center that ends directly at an equal distance from my body to my third-person perspective. I have only ever experienced it while on LSD, but not from just meditating before. It was always triggered by a very heavy dose or smoking salvia, and each time it felt very out of my control, just intense and overwhelming. But, this time.... This time, I perceived my body to be floating in a huge void, essentially as if the space surrounding my body that I mentioned is the only relevant thing in the environment. I was actually wearing a very colorful and abstract witch outfit, complete with the hat and a short dress that had some robe-like qualities to it. It actually didn't look cheesy or anything either, it was all highly psychedelic and far more intricate than any regular earthly clothes, it had a truly magical feel to it. My hands were outstretched to the sky, and since I could still myself in first-person even if I could see myself from third-person, I used this casting stance to simply release all of the emotion I possibly can into it, just like how I do strong dream control or throw my visuals around like normal, but with the complete freedom of being out-of-body in a void.
Correspondingly, enormous crystalline tower structures comprised of rainbow fractals and geometric imagery including concepts relating to human sexuality shot out of the abyss below me and built themselves high into the sky out of my passion. They all had a slight twist to them as well and so they all formed unique patterns as they worked their ways up. I simply did this until the release was complete and that world faded into nothingness, and I was back in bed....
I don't believe that it was much after that that the 4-HO-DET started to fade a bit, making the trip mostly like a somewhat enhanced LSD experience. Considering that the heaviest part of the trip was also over anyway, I pretty much spent the rest of the experience just thinking about everything that I had experienced and the nature of reality. I actually felt as though I was still tripping at least a bit for most of the next day during which I didn't sleep, and I kept smoking cannabis and using nitrous oxide to extend the effects and keep myself lost in thought and fantasy a bit longer.
That was the end of what I wrote for what would be relevant to this report. In the time since this experience has passed, what I can say is that it had a very profound impact on me. A significant emotional factor to this trip was that my experiences with impossible perceptions and infinity on the nitrous oxide really satisfied some of the cravings I've had for most of my life for needing to always push things to the limit. I feel that realizing this in the moment was actually a part of what allowed me to be so lucid when out-of-body, because I was just much more relaxed than I normally ever had been while tripping. Since this experience I also have just been able to get much more out of smaller doses of psychedelics than I used to, so that has only helped improve my attitude of taking things in moderation.
I was also going through sort of a rough emotional spot at the time of this trip, and having that cleared up headspace really helped me to think through a lot of the issues I was dealing with with more lucidity as well. Overall, it was a really positive experience, and one I would be happy to repeat in the future. But certainly not an experience I would take lightly; I can't even begin to imagine what a higher dose combo than what I've already taken would be like.
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