Citation: nervewing. "Everything All at Once: An Experience with 3,4-MD-PCP (exp115954)". Erowid.org. Jan 13, 2022. erowid.org/exp/115954
||(powder / crystals)
The next 3 paragraphs are heavy pharm/chem jargon, skip to the bottom of the preface for a summary of this new dissociative, skip to the end of the preface for my full report.
3,4-MD-PCP is yet another new arylcyclohexylamine. While most new ones have been following a fairly predictable pattern for design, 3,4-MD-PCP brings something new to the table. The 3,4-MD denotes a methylenedioxy group attached to the 3 and 4 positions of a phenyl ring. Chem savvy drug users may instantly recognize this as the distinctive substitution on the methamphetamine base that forms MDMA. It can also be seen in other stimulants like MDPV and Methylone. In this case, the methylenedioxygroup is seen attached to the phenyl ring in PCP.
So in seeing this, one may think- ďWow! So is this compound a combination of PCP and MDMA?Ē. That is not how drugs work though. The effects of MDMA are due to the interplay of the 3,4-MD substitution with the amphetamine base. Lacking that amphetamine base, a 3,4-MD group will not generate the empathogenic effects MDMA is so known for. It is simply a coincidence that a 3,4-MD group retains some sort of psychoactive activity on both the PCP and Methamphetamine base. Rather, this molecule stands alone as a unique and fascinating dissociative drug, vastly different from both PCP and MDMA.
It is worth noting that 3,4-MD-PCPr is the most selective NMDA antagonist known. (The source for this is Dr. Jason Wallachís dissertation) This means it would hypothetically offer about as pure of a dissociative experience as possible, as most other dissociatives hit a variety of other receptors, giving them peripheral stimulant effects. 3,4-MD-PCPr pretty much only hits the NMDA and DAT receptor (most other dissociatives hit serotonin and norepinephrine receptors in some way too)- there is perhaps something very interesting to be explored there- is this selectivity a result of the 3,4-MD substitution? Only further studies and more data can tell us.
Anyways, all the jargon aside, what is this compound like? It is a unique dissociative, I find it hard to really grasp the words to summarize it. Perhaps what characterized it the most was how many forms it could take, depending on dose or set or setting. It is an amorphous compound that molds itself to all sorts of situations. I could throw a million descriptors in the air and all of them would be true to some degree: warm, social, manic, stimulating, insightful, introspective, heavy, visual, colorful, disorienting, confusing, lucid, dizzy, dancey, grounded, precise, whimsical, futuristic, the list goes on! It is a truly exciting compound that has been fascinating to research. At times it felt sentient, like I was engaging in a complex interplay with some other being or some creature, curious and alive and fully interactive. It is my colorful dissociative little pet.
I ran several trials with this compound at doses ranging from 5 mg up to 50 mg. I tried it in different settings, like an outdoor rave, or the grocery store, or most times, just alone in my house. Each time felt quite distinct, but ultimately some commonalities began to develop between them. Most of all is a sense of being transferred to an enhanced other self, it is an odd sort of transitive mania where it feels like my consciousness and body have shifted to some other superior form, or perhaps reality has shifted around me. It feels like I am piloting my body as a mech, with impossibly precise handling and motor control. I found my ideal dose to be around 30-40 mg. 50 mg was overwhelming and lasted for a very long time. Lower doses are sociable and fun for dancing. Most of my trials were intranasal, though it is active orally and sublingually with about the same potency, just a longer duration. The duration is medium-long, dependent on dosage. A 50 mg dose lasted long into the night and I was still feeling it the next morning. A dose around 30 mg lasted for about 5-6 hours. The powder is unpleasant to snort- not extremely caustic but foul tasting and very powdery, coating the sinuses. The following report is for a 40 mg intranasal dose. I apologize for it being vague, contradictory, and abstract at points. This is a compound that really defies coherent description, even for me.
T0:00- Dose taken intranasally. Powder is light and fluffy and slightly stings and irritates but above all else, is pretty foul tasting. Snorting it is unpleasant, after chuffing down one line I have to wait a minute to finish the other. It is a sizable pile of powder.
T0:17- Onset, feeling a little bit dizzy and lightheaded. I am watching King of the Hill with my partner and playing Minecraft. The show slowly becomes harder and harder to make sense of. Iím having a lot of fun building my little castle though. I smoke a bit of cannabis as I come up.
T0:30- My head feels so heavy and floppy, my fingertips are numb, it is like my brain is immensely heavy and floating in the middle of my skull, not touching anything, just drawing in its surroundings with a sundering gravitational force. A powerful numbing sensation fades in from the front of my head. It feels like the room is moving, rocking on a gentle sea. My mind is adrift but grounded like a balloon anchored to the earth, tossing about in the breeze.
I feel like my consciousness has shifted slightly to the side of my body. I still try and follow the TV show but it makes little sense at this point. The events on the screen seem too disjointed and nonsensical to be of interest to me. I feel like I am emphasizing the wrong details of it and ignoring the parts that are actually important to understanding it. I doubt I could hold a conversation well right now and donít bother.
T1:00- Effects are still building, washing over me, that same sensation as laying in the ocean and having its waves buffet my head. Visuals begin to build in my periphery, tangled circuitry like dense networks of roots and mycelium twisting and turning at right angles, translucent and gelatinous. My entire field of vision is taken by an intense flashing, the world flickering in great violet pulses. The experience feels psychedelic, in the limber flow of thoughts, in my hyperfocus, in the anticipation building at the sight of iridescent visuals creeping in. It is being etched into my mind with a fiery bright laser. I am so dizzy, each moment I feel an odd contradiction building where I feel further from my body, receded into empty space- yet immaculately and completely in control of it. I get up and move around and donít feel particularly uncoordinated, rather like I am compensating for momentum and moving my muscles with an impossible precision. This is a confusing sensation because these limbs donít quite feel like they belong to me. I would liken it to a sensation of piloting my own body as if it were a mech suit, my consciousness a little homunculus of myself perched in my skull cavity, pulling levers and joysticks to make my muscles move. I feel dry like I have been desiccated under a heat lamp. The character of the comeup is that of a slowly sinking dissociation, smooth and steady and constant, not rushing or pulling or gushing forth like a churning river.
T1:30- Time for me to practice my standard for characterizing dissociatives- turning all the lights off, lying down in the total dark and listening to music through headphones. My selection this time around is a perennial favorite, Oneohtrix Point Neverís ďGarden of DeleteĒ. It is a familiar and exciting and interesting album that always provides a fascinating substrate for dynamic synesthesia.
My notes resume some 30 minutes later (I didnít finish the album I got too restless just lying there). This speaks to the character of the experience of course- as much fun as it is to just lie around, there is a compulsion to do something, to occupy my thoughts and actions with something more stimulating to all of my senses. I donít want to just aimlessly be in the dark. Furthermore, there wasnít much of a hole to speak of, there was no sense of all-encompassing dissociation, no sense of my body fading entirely. No sense of being altered and twisted in impossible ways or feeling like I am levitating or feeling as though there are odd pressures being exerted on me, as other dissociative holes tend to offer. I am quite aware that my body is there, lying still on the couch, and though it is still distinctly numb and dissociated, there is still that sense that my consciousness has shrunk or shifted or changed its form to no longer match me physically.
Despite this, it was still a deeply immersive experience, replete with amorphous synesthetic visuals, great monolithic things lurking in the distance. They werenít particularly vivid or active, swirling and blurring and at times faint and indistinct, but something was going on. The realms are soft, silken, smooth and flowing like winds through a meadow or banks of fog gently enveloping a rolling landscape. They are smooth and shaded like a computer render.
The sense of immersion came primarily, however, from a sense of presence, like the drug was a playmate, wrapping around me, clutching me, lurking in the wings to pounce and strike.
The sense of immersion came primarily, however, from a sense of presence, like the drug was a playmate, wrapping around me, clutching me, lurking in the wings to pounce and strike.
It has motion, desire, intention, all the trappings of a living breathing thing and yet it is nothing more than the cascade through my nerves of some white powder up my nose. I am sunken in its world as it flits and floats around me, curious and inquisitive, glowing in the night. I am taken with its wonder, swept up in its light and motion, possessed by its mind. How fascinating!
I stand up and return to the world, able to reintegrate easily. Standing and walking proves no issue. I feel imbued with a glowing energy, I feel like I have powered up and entered some ascendant form. Everywhere I turn my eyes seems like a perfectly composed movie shot. I stand tall and proud as energy flickers off of my muscles as they shift and move with impossible precision. Perhaps this is a form of mania.
T2:00- This experience is so full of contradictions and challenging descriptions. At once, lying still, I am lucid, I am able to think clearly, to interact with the world around me, yet at the same time, I feel so remarkably far from myself, distant and weird, I have been transformed into some glistening crystalline other.
I am now just laying about, eyes open, lights still off, music playing through my busted laptop speakers, browsing the internet. I bask in its glow, not fully paying attention to the screen, just thinking and meditating. Visuals stream and creep in the dark, melting and shifting with a steady motion like a curtain of water running down a wall. This drug seems to have little character of its own, rather it will imprint on my current conditions and emotions. It is alive, sentient, and fully amorphous. I am fixated on sex, sexuality, the nature of lust and desire, not in the sense of arousal but in the sense of it being a subject to ponder. This is probably imprinting on my immediate memory from earlier in the night where there was a vivid and intense encounter with multiple people. I take in my own body, my own form, I wonder how others experience desire, I wonder how others would experience desire towards me specifically, I think about how I personally experience desire. This compound offers so much to think about, but it remains relatively subtle, it gently suggests these thoughts, it doesnít force them through in some manic rush
This compound offers so much to think about, but it remains relatively subtle, it gently suggests these thoughts, it doesnít force them through in some manic rush
(though as mentioned in the last timestamp, there is certainly an above-baseline degree of mania to the experience- quite pleasant!)
T2:41- I go upstairs and hang out with my partner while they get ready for bed. The peak seems to be descending by now. At this point I feel talkative and social and I am messaging people on my phone just for idle chitchat. I am acutely aware of my body at this point, despite the storm of dissociative numbness and dizziness. I am aware of all the little aches and pains that are constant nowadays at the ripe old age of 26. My muscles in particular feel incredibly tense. I get on the floor and stretch and contort myself to my hearts content, pulling every muscle to be supple and limber. I am not a very flexible person, I canít even touch my toes, but I do the best I can and I feel great afterwards, with even more control of my body and limbs. It feels so empowering, I feel yet even more superhuman and ascendant, to continue the metaphor of piloting a mech I feel like I have undergone a full maintenance, all my parts oiled and cleaned and replaced to be fresh and fully, effortlessly mobile. I have nothing to do with this energy, with this sense of fulfillment, but that is okay, I am content to merely exist. I am blissful and languid and listless. I go back downstairs to be alone in the dark.
T3:30- Tossing about among the curtains of the world; I am lucid, mobile, functional. I donít feel like I could descend into a hole or pseudo-hole at this point no matter how hard I may try. I am still feeling sociable and eager to interact with others and I have my bearings about me well enough to do so competently. I feel a compulsion to talk to my grandmother who lives on the other side of the planet. I feel sad, that this is my direct ancestor but I know next to nothing about her. I only see her once every few years and we usually only exchange small talk. She is in pain, lonely, bored, and depressed. It feels so odd to be so detached from someone within my direct bloodline. I am taken by the sadness of this, of the great cultural divide in my upbringing, in how I must create a false version of myself to peacefully coexist with an entire half of my family that lives in a deeply Conservative Islamic culture. I feel pangs of empathy, vividly imagining her passing the days just watching TV in her apartment, quiet and dim, widowed and alone. It nearly brings tears to my eyes. The amorphous nature of this compound reveals itself yet again, a prismatic fox bounding and twisting and nuzzling among my emotions, pulling into the depths of my heart, tugging at the great insurmountable sadnesses that permeate this world, larger than us and beyond our control. It is a but a misfortune of geography after all, that we cannot be closer, see each other more, entwine our lives as family should.
Once my mind catches onto a subject, the compound does too, eagerly enveloping each thought with crystalline vines that quickly grow into dense tendrils slither upwards to the sky, firing off as a dazzling display of fireworks in my neurons. This is a compound of presence, but that presence is little but a hollow vessel, ready to take in every passing thought and experience, envelop it, amplify it, imbue it with vibrant color and a great swirling energy, crystallize it and construct it as something new in my mind. It is an imitator, a mimic, it will replicate whatever it touches, and within this is a boundless world.
T4:00- A distinct stimulated psychedelic comedown has set in, a state I often find in the comedown of certain dissociatives where my thoughts flow like a bursting dam, where my curiosity drives me to ravenously consume as much text as I possibly can. This state presents with many drugs for me actually, most characteristically psychedelics but also cannabis, and as stated before, many different dissociatives. It is a distinct type of cognitive enhancement that seems common across all those classes where my pliable brain just demands more, more information, an endless trail of investigation towards a trivial tangent, a vicious desire to just know. It is always a pleasant surprise when I enter this familiar state. The subjects of my ravenous readings for the night are the history of Miami and the history of skyscrapers. Reading and reading and reading like a nerd. There are intermittent pleasant conversations with others as I do this,this is a compound that offers a great deal in the realms of sociability
this is a compound that offers a great deal in the realms of sociability
T5:00- I have passed through the veil of an altered lucidity to a state closer to baseline. There is a lingering sense of a heavy dissociation in the back of my head and a bit in my limbs, but it is a warm buzzing afterglow smoldering itself out. There is a lingering gentle stimulation like a neon sign in a vacant room. I am still getting visuals in the dark, distinct images of forms and patterns swirling and flowing in my periphery.
T6:00- Back to baseline by now.
Conclusion: It is tough to really characterize 3,4-MD-PCP, each of my trial with it offered something different.
It is tough to really characterize 3,4-MD-PCP, each of my trial with it offered something different.
As far as commonalities go, I would say it is smooth, insightful, a bit manic, colorful, warm, euphoric, and sociable. It is a dizzy and functional dissociative, towing a line between being great for getting up and doing stuff while also being great for just lying in the dark. Perhaps its most remarkable feature is that it is so difficult to generalize- it is a truly amorphous compound that bent and molded itself around my brain, collecting and amplifying thoughts and emotions, its nature changing as my set and setting changed.
Perhaps its most remarkable feature is that it is so difficult to generalize- it is a truly amorphous compound that bent and molded itself around my brain, collecting and amplifying thoughts and emotions, its nature changing as my set and setting changed.
It has promise of a true jack of all trades dissociative, versatile and enjoyable in a wide variety of settings, depending on dosage. Lower doses were fantastic for dancing and socializing, medium doses are great for being around close friends or playing video games, higher doses can be disorienting and incapacitating but can make it nice to just meditate and listen to music. There is a lot of potential here! Dosage seems to correlate with duration, with higher doses having a significantly longer peak and comedown. Any dose offers a pleasant afterglow even after the other effects have faded.
The physical dissociation is present but not overwhelmingly heavy or incapacitating. At times I felt immaculately in control of my muscles and my body, almost superhuman. It is great for dancing. The sense of dissociation is one of steady immersion, there is no rush or stimulating push in my nerves, though I would say this drug is quite stimulating relative to dissociatives like ketamine or DCK, though it is a neutral, background stimulation, no force to it at all. The headspace is meditative and contemplative like a psychedelic, and can turn into a tranquil stillness when occupied with over activities. There is a warm euphoria throughout. Visual effects are present but not particularly remarkable, the same drifting patterns and textures that other dissociatives seem to offer. With my eyes closed, the visual space in the darkness was vague and nondescript, as if the drug was telling me to stop lying around and enjoy the world around me. This drug has a sense of interactivity and immersion, as though it is a presence that will bend to the thoughts and emotions of the user, twisting and twirling around them and shifting to fit whatever the mood and atmosphere may be. It is truly a fascinating dissociative, even if it may not be to the liking of all people or fill the roles they desire, it can perhaps be molded to whatever function a person may need, and ultimately it is an extremely interesting novelty to explore!
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