Los Angeles Psychedelic Science Symposium - June 22-23
"LAPSS into Higher Consciousness" at this 3 day conference in LA.
Serotonergic Pain Relief
by Floyd F
Citation:   Floyd F. "Serotonergic Pain Relief: An Experience with MDMA, 4-AcO-DET, 5-MeO-DIPT (exp14936)". Erowid.org. May 27, 2002. erowid.org/exp/14936

100 mg oral MDMA (pill / tablet)
  14 mg oral 4-AcO-DET (powder / crystals)
  12 mg oral 5-MeO-DiPT (powder / crystals)


This is not intended as a single trip report but a report on a notable effect of a variety of substances which I've experienced.

I suffer from a collapsed hip caused by a genetic condition, which is often very painful. A total hip replacement is not advised so long as the pain is tolerable, as due to my age and activity level, the replacement would be likely to fail in a few years time. I have generally avoided taking pain medications due to a desire not to become dependent, however when the pain is very severe I have found that 500-1000mg acetaminophen can slightly blunt the edge of the pain. Opiates are largely ineffective for me, and cause me to have severe nausea as well.

The first time I tried Ecstasy, I was fortunate to obtain a pill of extremely high purity ~100mg MDMA from a friend. The experience was wonderful in many ways, as we spent the night talking over some things that had happened recently that had me very upset, and I managed to figure out things that had been confusing me for months. But the most remarkable thing of all, shortly after the come-up I realized that my hip was amazingly flexible and completely free of pain.

When the effects of the substance wore off, the hip pain gradually returned. I do not know if they returned fully to baseline immediately, but it was clearly a temporary but quite profound effect. During the experience I was not unable to feel pain, but I was able to *not* feel pain, which is to say, the chronicness was absent.

Not wanting to lose the special magic, I abstained from using MDMA for six months, but when I did (using another from the same batch of pills), I found my experience once again to include this amazing pain relief property. Again though, once the substance wore off, pain returned.

I've also found similar temporary relief from Hawaiian Baby Woodrose. And I'd read that migraine and cluster headache sufferers were finding recourse to hallucinogens in dealing with their variety of chronic pain, with psilocybin mushrooms being particularly recommended.

As it turned out, another friend of mine had found a small quantity of 4-Acetoxy-Diethyltryptamine and offered a portion of it to me. I knew this was supposed to be similar in effect to psilocybin, so I took 14mg of this substance and again my pain disappeared. Being sure that the pain would shortly return I took great care as always not to overextend myself, but strangely enough I didn't really notice my hip becoming too painful at all the next day. Since there is some natural variation from one day to the next I chalked that up to the fact that I'd been going relatively easy on it and had been careful not to strain myself the day before.

Some weeks later, three friends and I tried a higher dose of the 4-AcO-DET (18mg) and two of us (including me) combined this with an earlier dose of ~100mg MDMA. This experience was not a wonderful one, our set and setting were wrong and conflicts occurred between members of our group due to a failure to establish clear objectives at the outset. I'd been putting a lot of strain on my leg recently, and it was surprising that the hip pain again did not return afterwards. Nor the next day. Nor the entire week following. It wasn't that pain had completely gone, but it was reduced so enormously from normal that it was virtually ignorable, and flexibility remained well above what it usually was. Only after a week did pain gradually start to return, and slowly build back up over the following week.

It was at this point that I realized I was onto something of significant therapeutic value. It is one thing to experience pain relief while in an altered state, the trade-off isn't one which is likely to improve one's productive life. But if it is possible to have lasting benefits for a whole week after dosing, that is another matter entirely. So I decided I had to try to figure out what substances and doses worked best for therapeutic effect, apart from their recreational potential.

I already knew that 4-AcO-DET seemed to offer the most significant benefit at this point, so I hoped to reduce the dose in order to make the experience more manageable, as my objective wasn't to be tripping out of my mind every weekend. I tried reducing to 10mg and had one of the signal best experiences of my life, resetting some of my life priorities and working out my relationships with many people over the course of the evening. And afterwards, I again observed the pain relief to continue for days.

At this point I tried to see if I would be able to obtain more of this wonderful substance but found that the supplier had gone out of business, and none could be found. While I still had a small bit in reserve I was concerned that I not use it up too quickly when more might not be forthcoming. I again tried Hawaiian Baby Woodrose, and found the effects to be as temporary as ever. Moreover, once the effects wore off the residual tryptamine pain relief I had had beforehand seemed also to have evaporated. It is as if the second substance overrode the first. And I had a weird headspace for a few days thereafter.

Reverting back to 4-AcO-DET I reduced my dosage further to just 5mg. This led to a pleasant but not very intense experience and only nominal pain relief, with only a little residual benefit either.

Last week my leg was killing me, I'd been exerting myself too much lately, and it was difficult even sleeping at night due to the chronic pain. Just then, I received a small packet of another substance, 5-Methoxy-Diisopropyltryptamine, which I hoped might work as well as the 4-AcO-DET.

So this past Friday, I took 8mg, and after an hour was feeling little or no effect while others who had also obtained some of this material were feeling a great deal more. I'd eaten a large meal not too many hours before and that may have led to my slow response (I'm usually VERY fast to respond to things, and typically sensitive to lower doses than others as well). I decided to boost by taking an additional 4mg. After awhile I was feeling very pleasantly, and unlike the 4-AcO-DET the experience was mostly physical with no difficult mental effects. I was very relaxed all evening, laid back in a way that I rarely am, and I found it tremendously easy just going with the flow of things. About three hours in, my companions shared a bowl of kb from which I abstained (pot has never agreed with me) but the second-hand smoke seemed to bring up my effects a bit.

Hip pain seemed to flow away slowly over the course of the evening, not dramatically as with other substances. But by morning I felt it had lifted almost completely, and it hasn't come back for two days. So far the pain relief is as good as any from 4-AcO-DET but with a far less mind-bending trip, so this may actually turn out to be the ideal substance for my purposes.

Far from scheduling these wonderful tryptamine allies, they should be studied for pharmacological pain relief. It isn't only migraine sufferers who can benefit from them, anyone with chronic pain might find them to be an amazing tool. And in my case, it may allow me to defer total hip replacement surgery for much longer than otherwise, thus keeping me from having far greater problems down the road.

Exp Year: 2002ExpID: 14936
Gender: Male 
Age at time of experience: Not Given 
Published: May 27, 2002Views: 39,256
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Migraines (154), MDMA (3), 5-MeO-DiPT (57), 4-AcO-DET (188) : Various (28), Health Benefits (32), Retrospective / Summary (11)

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