Support honest drug info & help us reach a new high for
the number of $5+ donations in a month. Our goal is 1,422. $10-$500 donations are doubled! [see progress]

Donate Cryptocurrency
A Feeling of Emotional Flatness
Syrian Rue & Mushrooms
by EntheoJourneyer
Citation:   EntheoJourneyer. "A Feeling of Emotional Flatness: An Experience with Syrian Rue & Mushrooms (exp96480)". Feb 2, 2017.

T+ 0:00
1.0 g oral Syrian Rue (extract)
  T+ 0:40 1.2 g oral Mushrooms (ground / crushed)
  T+ 1:15 1.1 g oral Mushrooms  
  T+ 1:40 0.6 g oral Mushrooms  


People say mushrooms are potentiated by Syrian Rue. I thought Iíd give it a try, maybe save money on mushrooms.

Iíve done 10 high dose (5g to 9.2g) mushroom journeys with an experienced guide and follow-up with a therapist for integration, 10 low dose (2g to 2.6g) mushroom journeys by myself, and 5 Ayahuasca ceremonies over the last year and a half. I do mushrooms, after purifying with sage, laying down, blindfolded, with music playing, either orchestrated by the guide or my playlist. I play Tuu (most representative), Jorge Reyes, Constance Demby, Michael Sterns, Aeoliah, Tulku, Kitaro, R. Carlos Nakai, Anugama, to name a few. I include a few ambient electronic song mixes because I like the sound of them on mushrooms.

Reading online, to fully inhibit my MAO for my weight of about 100kg, at 1.5 mg alkaloids/kg, I would want 150mg, which at 3%, 30mg/g, would be 5g of seeds. I see experience reports of vomiting and difficulties, which Iím not looking for. I get the impression extracting might reduce the stomach load. For my initial attempt, I grind 1g of seeds and boil for a half hour in a little water and juice from a lime for acid. I just do a single extraction to start with, which Iíll use as my baseline, figuring probably most of the alkaloids come out the first time, and the seeds are inexpensive. I filter it through a paper towel to get a tablespoon of yellow-orange, slightly murky liquid, which I drink in several sips along with a little water to wash it down, at 10:25pm, (T0 Ė :40). The taste is tolerable. My last food was 10:00am. Iím going with the 12 hour MAOI diet idea.

I give the MAOI time. I seem to feel some slight effect from the Rue, by the time I take 1.2g of ground mushrooms in a little hot water, 40 minutes later, at 11:05pm (T0). I start with a partial dose because if I took 2.5g at the start and did get a doubling effect some people reported, the effect of 5g would be too far beyond what I have experienced by myself. I start my journey playlist, get under the covers wearing warm clothes, don my blindfold and gloves.

35 minutes after taking the 1.2g I donít feel muchóI am relaxed with the music though. It could take up to an hour for the mushrooms to take full effect, but I figure if the Rue was really going to push the mushrooms over the top Iíd probably be able to tell by now. I donít want to spread out the mushrooms so much that I donít get the effect, so Iíll take the chance. I eat a 1.1g stem and push back my playlist 10 minutes because the songs I want to come as it is taking effect are almost here already.

Iíve been planning to increase my mushroom dose beyond my typical 2.5g level, the Rue doesnít seem to be making a big difference, so at around (T0 + 1:00) I eat a 0.6g stem, for a total now of 2.9g spread over about an hour. At this time I am seeing not the distinct colored shifting tubes I sometimes see, but an indistinct, creamy colored background. It is a nice feeling and I am close to the feeling of floating in the music. At one point I see shading of one color into another, which I have never seen on mushrooms, only on Ayahuasca. Also I was yawning, which happened with Ayahuasca, which was distracting--it would pull me back out into awareness of me being a body on the bed. I think these must be effects of the Rue. I attribute the lack of more colors and a full feeling of floating to having spread out the mushrooms.

At some point I remember to voice to myself my intentions and questions I wrote down as preparation, as some have suggested. Iím confused as to how to phrase them correctly. I think I need to prepare exactly what to say. I donít want to just keep verbalizing, so I turn my attention back to the music.

Iím getting warm arenít I? It must be gradual since I spread out the mushrooms, instead of suddenly hot, from the psilocybin conversion to psilocin. At (T0+2:10) I remove all my clothes, a half hour later than usual. At this point in the journey the colors and floaty feelings are past. This is the stage of low-dose journeys in which revelations may occur for me.

Iím feeling raw and vulnerable, wonder if I want to keep living, an issue Iíve been dealing with. My doctor just told me I should do invasive procedures to check for the possibility of fast-moving prostate cancer. Apparently, this affected me unconsciously more than I realized. Iím aging anyway. Life is so complicated. Iím alone. Shall I have the procedures done? I think I will, but what if I donít? Cancer is painful. If I could just snap my fingers and it would be over, would I?

Iím feeling a bit over the top, beyond where Iíve been on my 2.5g regimen, not so in control of my psyche. Maybe this is beyond what I should do on my own? Maybe this is why my guide had me limit to 2.5g. Do I feel a tinge of burning in my stomach? What if I get sick, Iím all on my own here? I feel emotionally flat, isolated. I grab my teddy bear and hold it to me to help feel more human.
I grab my teddy bear and hold it to me to help feel more human.
I think to myself this is negatively setting my psyche up to feel Iím all by myself in the world. At least with a guide there is someone there smiling at me when I take my blindfold off and first open my eyes; I need to find other people to journey with.

I attribute these feelings to the Rue--almost a depression, a flatness. It is not pleasant. It feels like I need to do something to protect myself, for my emotional well-being, to feel myself. It is going on and on. The music is almost too much after a while, but I donít want to turn it off either. I want it to be over, think of getting up to escape it, stop it, but I tell myself that would be trying to resist the Rue, just surrender.

A few actions arose: moving my hips a way I never had before; inhaling so sharply it vibrates my nose, that I interpret as grabbing at life; sounding at full volume from my belly (thankfully no nearby neighbors). These expressions from the psyche validate the journey to me. Iíve had forms of them before on mushrooms.

I get up and eat. Usually this occurs at 2:45 with a single dose of mushrooms. Iím amazed to find it is still so early. It felt like it was going on forever, but apparently time was subjectively elongated by the Rue. Iím ravenous and feeling almost like Iím drunk, a bit uncoordinated, antsy and in a hurry with nowhere to go. I go back to bed but canít sleep. My body keeps twitching, like has occurred with Ayahuasca. These are from the Rue. I think to myself Thatís why people have commented about Rue extending the durationóthey wanted it to be over.

T0+4:00, 3:00am
Canít sleep. I have an urge to go outside. I do, itís good seeing the real world. I walk barefoot. Back inside, I want sexual stimulation. Maybe I want to do it while I can, see if any blood still shows up. Iím not really up to it though. I still feel uncomfortably emotionally flat.

T0+8:30, 7:30am Finally, I fall asleep, wake up four hours later. This is probably mostly baseline from the Rue (9 hours after).

T0+18:00, 5:00pm Emotional flatness gone, still feel raw, in need of people (which might be a good thing). Iím not clear yet about the benefits of the journey. I feel more substantial from having done the breathing and shouting.

I identify aspects that are typical of my mushroom experiences and other aspects that I attribute to the Rue. The Rue aspects of feeling emotionally flat, possibly the rawness and isolation, antsy drunk-like non-coordination, yawning, body twitching, wanting it to be over, slight burning feeling in stomach were generally not comfortable.

I havenít had Rue by itself, but I use Ayahuasca as a reference. It is not clear to me whether Rue ďpotentiated the mushroomsĒ at all or mostly just added its own psychoactive effects.
It is not clear to me whether Rue ďpotentiated the mushroomsĒ at all or mostly just added its own psychoactive effects.
I havenít had enough of the Rue to fully inhibit my MAO, so that could be a factor, but psilocybin is already orally active. Iím having a hard time seeing why I would want to repeat this experiment with a higher dose (five times higher?) of Rue, and maybe get into vomiting to boot. If the ďover the topĒ feeling was a characteristic of mushrooms PLUS Rue, maybe it is possible there is a qualitatively different synergistic place to go, to explore, beyond the sum of two effects.

If ALL the Rue did was make the mushrooms ďmore,Ē that would be good. It is clear this is not the case for me. So far, it seems to me if I want a potent mushroom experience I can just take more mushrooms. If I want (at least the MAOI properties of) what the Rue might have, which seems to me I donít, I can attend an Ayahuasca ceremony which has been developed over generations and there is support.

Exp Year: 2012ExpID: 96480
Gender: Male 
Age at time of experience: 69 
Published: Feb 2, 2017Views: 3,397
[ View as PDF (for printing) ] [ View as LaTeX (for geeks) ] [ Switch Colors ]
Mushrooms (39), Syrian Rue (45) : Alone (16), Personal Preparation (45), Music Discussion (22), Combinations (3)

COPYRIGHTS: All reports are copyright Erowid.
TERMS OF USE: By accessing this page, you agree not to download or analyze the report data without contacting Erowid Center and receiving written permission prior to your downloading the data.

Experience Reports are the writings and opinions of the individual authors who submit them.
Some of the activities described are dangerous and/or illegal and none are recommended by Erowid Center.

Experience Vaults Index Full List of Substances Search Submit Report User Settings About Main Psychoactive Vaults